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Important Information and Frequently Asked Questions
Quick links....
*NEW* Real and Fake True Religion Jeans
*UPDATED* Real and Fake Seven for All Mankind Jeans
My refund and return policy
All sales are final unless the item has a fault or was misrepresented in the auction description. If I have made a mistake describing an item I will refund you in full when you return the item to me.
I want you to be happy with your item. Please email if you have any questions at all before you bid - I will always be happy to send more measurements and photographs, and to answer any questions you have.
Fit, Sizing and Measurement Information
Here's the answers to some of the questions you may have if you want to bid on or have won one of my auctions....
I give the sizes of the item for sale in the auction, the approximate UK size. That's a guide though and the best way to work out if an item will fit you is to compare the measurements of a similar item you own that fits you well. If the measurements are very similar the item is most likely fit you. If you need any more measurements on any item, please email me. You must measure a similar item - if the auction is for non-stretch jeans you must measure non-stretch jeans. And if the auction is for stretch jeans you must measure stretch jeans.
To get the best idea of fit, I give the following measurements in the auction.
Waist - the physical measurement of the actual waistband of the jeans. Since they are low-rise jeans and will fit below your natural waist, the measurement of the waistband is going to be larger than your natural waist and the size the jeans are tagged.
Hips - the widest part of your body and the widest part of the jeans. I measure straight across the jeans, at approximatly the level of the bottom of the zipper.
Rise - a measure of how low the jeans are! It's the distance between the waistband and the crotch (where the two inseams meet). As a rough guide, a rise of 9 inches is low rise but tasteful (like Gwyneth Paltrow), a rise of 8 inches is pretty low (like Cameron Diaz), and 7 inches is very low (Britney Spears & Paris Hilton style)!
Inseam - the measurement of the inside leg seam.
Cuffs - the measurement across the bottom of the leg opening - this will tell you how flared the jeans are.
The measurements for non-stretch jeans are more straighforward - they are all taken with the jeans lying flat and unstretched.
The measurements for stretch jeans are more complex. Different jeans have different amounts of lycra, and some hardly stretch at all, some stretch lots!
So for stretch jeans, if there's two measurements given, such as "Hips - 38-40 inches" that's the relaxed, unstretched, measurement, and the measurement with the most (comfortable) amount of stretch they have.
Seven and Seven for all Mankind Jeans - what you really, really need to know!!
Why are there so many Pink A-pocket jeans on eBay?
Here's the story of what are commonly known as "Seven" jeans. What are called "Seven" jeans are actually really called "Seven for all Mankind" jeans, and it's much less of a mouthful to say just "Seven"!!
Seven for all Mankind jeans were created a few years ago, they are the brainchild of Jerome Dahan who is a master tailor and he figured that if he cut denim in just the right way then you can get a pair of jeans that fit perfectly, flatters, looks sexy, and what's more lifts, shapes and sculpts the bottom too. And after much trial and error, Seven for all Mankind jeans were born.
And it's not just the cut, the denim is beautiful quality, the treatments to each pair are done by hand for a natural look. They have so much style too - the fading pattern on Seven for all Mankind is very distinctive. And then there's THOSE back pockets with THAT squiggle design and THOSE red lables and Seven for all Mankind jeans are unmistakable!
Seven for all Mankind soon became a huge hit in America, shops here still can't keep them on the shelves even today. Celebrities picked up on them, and if you read any style magazine, or Hello, or OK, you'll spot several pairs. In Vogue's "As Seen" pages, half the people in denim are wearing Seven for all Mankind jeans.
Of course for all that they cost a fortune, but that's what eBay is for, getting a bargain, isn't it!!
Now, here's where it gets complicated. A pair of jeans like Seven for all Mankind, with their amazing powers and distinctive style are very desirable.
So other people started thinking and wondering how they could get in on the act. There's a few other brands that have appeared that mimic Seven for all Mankind in looks, in particular the back pocket design. They also have very similar names. One brand is called simply "Seven". Another brand is called "Seven7" or "Seven 7". These are NOT "Seven for all Mankind" jeans.
They don't have the same cut, the denim is not terribly nice and they fit funny. You know some jeans that are lowrise, you sit down and you show the world your knickers? That's them.
The easist way to tell the difference is to look carefully at the back pockets of the jeans for sale.
This is a picture, and a closeup, of the back pockets of a genuine pair of Seven for all Mankind jeans.
This is a pair of "Seven7" jeans. Look at the back pockets, they are different, more like loops. You can also see the fit is rather odd!
"Seven7" jeans were produced in 2003 by a US high-street store called Express to deliberatly look really, really similar to Seven for all Mankind jeans. Seven for all Mankind sued Express and Express had to remove their Seven7 jeans from their stores. Can you guess where the unsale-able Seven7 jeans ended up? Out the back door and all over eBay :(
I belive you can also get "Seven7" jeans from TJ Maxx for about 5. If you have 5 burning a hole in your pocket, you'll spend it much better buying a pair in Topshop :)
This is a pair of "Seven7" jeans pockets. Yeah, i know it's a ebay picture. If you recognise it as your photograph, you stole my descriptions and used it in your auction so i think that's fair :)
There's a couple of other variations on the theme, such as these ones, they are not Seven for All Mankind either.
Thing to look for is the design in the very first picture, that is a genuine pair of Seven for all Mankind jeans.
The other way to tell, is that Seven for all Mankind jeans are branded "7 for all Mankind" on the inside of the waistband, on the red tag on the back pocket, and it's printed on the inside of the pocket. Never plain "Seven" or "Seven7". The buttons and studs are printed with "Seven for all Mankind". The important part that MUST be there is the "for all Mankind" part.
Here's examples of what the logos look like.
This is printed on the inside of the waistband, at the back. You can also just see the button has "Seven for all Mankind" embossed into it.
This is printed on the pocket lining of the front left pocket. You can see the "for all Mankind" printing and also the back of the studs have "7" embossed into them. Some of the copies also do this, some don't. Look for the proper logo.
If you don't belive me, here's some websites that sell genine Seven for all Mankind jeans so you can have a look at their photographs to check for yourself.
In fact I'd encourage you to do that, and do that for any eBay purchase or a designer item or anything that can be copied. Always do research if you are buying something you are not familiar with, so you know what you are buying.
Seven for all Mankind's site is www.SevenforallMankind.com
Brown's in London www.BrownsFashion.com.
eLuxury. They've got the most fabulous Dior clothes too but that's getting off topic... www.eluxury.com
Or visit Browns, Selfridges, or Harvey Nichols, and some House of Fraser shops carry them too.
The Seven for all Mankind brand then confused everything by making jeans with different pocket designs - like the Dojo jeans, which have "7" on the back pockets, the A pocket jeans which have (guess what) "A" on each back pocket, and cargo pants, and even jeans with no back pockets. So if what you are planning to buy is not a basic pair of jeans, check carefully that they are branded "Seven for all Mankind" or "7 for all Mankind" and not just "Seven" or "Seven7" or "Se7en" and you'll get a real pair.
And to further confuse matters, about 3 years ago, the branding used on the real Seven for all Mankind jeans was changed to what you currently see on their jeans. Some older jeans have designs like this, although they are not that common now.
These are real Seven for all Mankind jeans too - the important part is the "for all Mankind" in the name. The branding on the buttons and studs is the same as current styles. These pictures are the logo on the inside of the waistband, and the printing on the inside of the front left pocket.
And even further back in time, when the brand first started up, they used this branding. These jeans are at least 5 years old. The inside of the waistband says "Seven for all Mankind". Sorry it's hard to read.... but that's what it says. The rivits and buttons are marked "Seven for all Mankind". The inside pocket says "Seven" and the back of the studs aren't marked. The label on the back pocket says "Seven" too. It's very, very ususual to see jeans like this now - you certainly won't see new pairs with branding like this. But these are genuine Seven for all Mankind jeans.
So if Seven for all Mankind jeans are so rare & desirable, why are there so many Seven jeans on eBay?
Unfortunatly, most of them are counterfeit copies :(
They vary in quality from very obvious fakes made in very cheap denim, to almost identical in appearance to the real thing and very deceptive (still icky quality though).
Sometimes it's very hard to spot the copies from photographs but here's a couple of ways to help you tell the difference.
- Look at the back pockets
On a real pair, the squiggly stitching is about 2/3 down on the pockets - it's not centered on the pocket. Some fakes have the stitching too high on the pockets. Also, some fakes have the proportion of the stitching wrong - sometimes the design looks squashed or stretched or too wide. Compare to a genuine pair.
- Plastic bags
Seven for all Mankind jeans DON'T come packaged in plastic bags. This is a trick counterfeiters use to make you think you have a genuine article direct from the factory.
- White stickers on the outside of the jeans
Or, more than one white sticker anywhere on the jeans. These are always fake. The white sticker on a new pair is attached to the inside of the waistband, just above the front left pocket lining.
- Style/Cut codes used by counterfeiters
The cut code is a misleading name - it actually refers to a very small batch of jeans produced on the same day. If you go to Harvey Nichols or Barneys and look at several pairs of the same style, chances are they will all have different cut numbers, or maybe only one or two of the same.
A lot of fakes all have the same Cut codes. Lets say you are looking at an auction for a pair of jeans. Note the Cut code, or ask the seller for the Cut number. Then, search eBay for that number in a title & description search. If you get more than a couple of pairs the jeans are probably fake. This isn't a guarantee of a counterfiect copy - they probably copied a genuine code. But be wary of jeans that do have the same style/cut code.
- Check the care label
Some copies have the care labels attached wrongly. The care label is made of two parts, a label with the cut number and washing instructions, and another label with the Seven for all Mankind logo on. In a geniune pair, the label with the Seven for all Mankind logo label is UNDERNEATH the washing instructions label. In the copies, the Seven for all Mankind label is on top of the washing instructions label.
- Spelling Mistakes Some counterfeiters can't spell! Seven for all Mankind jeans have washing instructions printed on the inside of the pocket as well as on the care label. This is what it usually says :
Wash in warm with like colors
Do not bleach tumble dry low
Remove promptly warm iron if desired
Some fake pairs have spelling mistakes - for instance i've seen jeans that say DAY instead of DRY, and AEMOVE instread or REMOVE.
- Selling too many pairs Seven for All Mankind jeans really do sell out quickly - the most desirable styles like the Crystal pocket jeans, the A-pockets, and whatever is new in particular. A seller is never going to be able to obtain several identical pairs unless they are a official retailer of Seven for all Mankind jeans. Have a look at what else the seller is offering - if it's the same style in all the other sizes be suspicious. If they are an official retailer they should be happy to show you proof of that.
A good way to check - ask for their business name and call Seven for all Mankind customer services and they can tell you if they an authorised supplier or not!
- My Wholesaler Assures Me They are Authentic Nonsense. There are only two ways to get Authentic Seven for all Mankind jeans. From the company, or from an authorised retailer, which will, without exception, be a high-end department store or boutique. NOT through a wholesaler. Seven for all Mankind does not supply their jeans to Wholesalers. If your seller claims they got the jeans from a wholesaler then they are fake.
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Strange Sizing Seven for all Mankind jeans usually run true-to-size, or can be cut on the generous side. The stretch denim styles in particular are usually fit a slightly larger size than the tag says. Seven for all Mankind jeans that run small do exist but are very uncommon. Auctions that say their jeans run *small* may not be genuine jeans. Genuine Seven for all Mankind jeans also don't have short inseams - most have 32/33/34 inch inseams. A pair with 31 inseam is probably a fake.
This is not a definative test of whether a pair is fake - if an auction says the jeans for sale run small, check it out futher before bidding.
Really Useful Website - No Fake Jeans has photos of all the features of fake jeans described above, examples of real and fake jeans in lots of different styles with lots of photos of real and fake jeans. It's in German but is very easy to use and very useful if you are checking out a pair of jeans. And, it has lots of photos of Citizens of Humanity jeans which are also widely counterifeted.
Another Really Useful Website - www.HonestForum.com The "I love Seven" forum is filled with highly useful people who can help you spot fakes, and also join you in delighting over your fave denim. There's also a Citizens of Humanity (COH) jeans forum which you must visit if you are shopping for those jeans on eBay. and a True Religion forum too. If you keep reading there's a little more info on True Religion on this page....
Before you bid on, or purchase a pair of jeans...
Look at the seller's feedback. Some well-know sellers of Fake jeans seemingly have good feedback - often in the the 1000's. Some of these people don't know what they are buying, some don't care they have brough counterfeits becasue the price was good. Look back through their feedback for any negative comments on Fake goods - if there's more than one or two then please think twice - if there's several walk away.
This is a useful tool - this picks out Neutral and Negative feedback for a seller,
http://www.toolhaus.org/cgi-bin/negs
Look at the photos in the auction and compare them to the photos on at www.FakeSeven.com. If there are no photos in the listing, ask the seller for a clear photographs of the inside pocket, and care label, and back pockets, and the cut number for the jeans. The easiest features to see are, correctly positioned stitching, the correct font on the lables, and for the care and logo labels being the right way around, and for no spelling mistakes!
Don't buy jeans from a seller who only has a stock or catalogue photo - always make sure you see pictures of the actual item you are bidding for before you place your bid.
Before purchase a pair of Seven for all Mankind jeans, ask the seller where they got them from. If they brought them from Selfridges, they should be happy to tell you.
Ask the seller what their refund policy is. If they sell you a pair of jeans as "Genuine Seven for All Mankind" jeans and they turn out to be fakes, the seller is breaking the law. If they say Guaranteed Authentic in their auctions, they should be able to stand behind that.
There are real pairs on eBay - if the seller brought them in Harvey Nichols and have the orignal recipt, or other proof of authenticity, then you should have a real pair!
I've already brought a pair and I think they are fake
If you have brought a pair already and are now worried, or you know they are fake - First verify that you actually have a fake pair. Now, contact your seller with your concerns. If they guarantee satisfaction, or guarantee authenticity, ask for that guarantee to be honored, say you want to return them for a refund. Hopefully the seller didn't realise what they were selling and will be happy to refund you.
Here's a website with lots of helpful information about requesting refunds and what steps you can take next if you have recived a fake/counterfiet item. It actually refers to counterfeit handbags but the priciple is the same whatever the item.
http://ihatecounterfeitbags.info/iwonafake-whatnow
No luck? Here's some more links about making Fraud complaints to eBay, to Paypal, to Law Enforcement,
http://cgi3.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewUserPage&userid=mioka
For sellers who read this and are now worried they might be selling fakes - check the authenticy for yourself by speaking to Seven for all Mankind, or a store that sells the jeans, or check with your wholesalers, suppliers, or the person you brought them from. Verify they are real or not - and if not please don't sell them. Or at least sell them as copies/replicas/look-a-like so your buyers know what they are getting.
It's not just Seven jeans.... Real And Fake True Religion jeans
Currently there seems to be a flood of fake True Religion jeans on eBay - like 95% of all the pairs for sale. And sadly, the counterfeiters are getting their act together and the fakes look more like the real thing than ever - but if you see a photo of a pair they look right - but to see them in person, they feel nasty - the denim is often the very cheap, really stretchy kind, and they fit horribly!
Read the section above about Seven for all Mankind fakes - a lot of that information holds true for True Religion jeans.
For instance, it's practically impossible to obtain more than a couple of pairs. A seller with 10 all the same is selling fakes.
A seller shipping from China, or Hong Kong, with a number of jeans for sale, is almost certainly selling fakes. True Religion jeans, like Seven for all Mankind, are made in America, not China. Think about it - how would a seller in Asia get hold of several pairs of jeans produced half-way around the world? And at those seemingly fabulous prices? Please note i'm not having a go at China or Hong Kong, or saying all sellers from there are bad. I recently brought a pair of very beautiful, very real Louis Vuitton sandals from a lovely seller in Hong Kong. My point is the majority of counterfiet items are produced in the far east and therefore a number of sellers based there are taking advantage of that.
Check the seller's feedback - be very wary of someone with any feedback saying an item is fake. Walk alway from anyone with a lot of feedback saying items are fake.
Short inseams are another givaway sign of a fake - unless they have been hemmed, all True Religion jeans have 33 or 34 inch inseams. And, like Seven jeans, they rarely don't run small - you will often need the next size down in a genuine pair of True Religion jeans. Jeans that run small should be veiwed with suspicion.
Check The Pocket Stitching The horseshoe stitching on the back pockets should be symetrical, and centered on the back pockets. I've seen fakes where the stitching is mis-shapen, or not totally centered on the pockets.
Check the Zipper Real True Religion jeans use a high-quality, chunky, rectangular silver YKK zip-pull in the fly. Fakes usually use a cheaper, lower quality zipper - often the YKK brand too but a cheaper version.
Check the Buddha On the back of the waistband where the white tag is attached, the quality of the embroidery in the logo is foten lower in the fake pairs. Fon instancce, the Buddha's hand has 4 fingers and a thumb that you can clearly see in real pairs - fake Buddhas often have 3 fingers and a lower overall sharpness and quality in the embroidery.
I know it would be really helpful to have photos of these things - i'll try to add some soon.
This isn't a total guide to fake jeans - but are warning signs that will let you elimitae a large proportion of fakes. For more information on True Religion,
This is A Really Useful Website - www.HonestForum.com The "I love TR" forum is filled with highly useful people who can help you spot fakes, and also if you want to yak with other denim fans too. It's a good place to verify a pair of jeans for auction before you bid.
And why do I care anyway? Counterfeit items suck.
Counterfeting almost always supports organised crime, including terrorism. For example, the 1993 World Trade Center bombing in New York was partly funded by the sales of counterfiet designer handbags.
Counterfeit items are usually poor quality - the idea is they look like the real item - but it won't wear like it or last as long. A factory producing fakes wants to get as many items out the door as possible. A fake pair of Seven jeans costs less than $5 to make.
And following on - if the person making fake goods has no scruples about selling fakes, their factories are most likely dangerous sweatshops with no though for the overworked underpaid untrained workers sewing jeans together for 1p an hour, 16 hours a day. Real designer items are not - for example Gucci goods are made by craftspeople in Italy and Seven for all Mankind jeans are made in Los Angeles by people paid a proper wage. A significant part of the higher price of real designer items comes from emplying skilled workers, training their staff, having a safe work place, and paying the people who make them a decent wage.
You can sell a second-hand pair of genuine Seven for all Mankind jeans in good condition for around 0. A second-hand fake pair is worth at Oxfam if it doesn't fall apart in the wash first.
Sadly, fake items inflate the price of authentic items as the original manufacturer has to spend money on investigations, policing and lawsuits, and they loose revenue from people who buy the fakes.
I have no problem with look-a-like items, designer inpsired items, things that kind-of look like the real thing but plainly aren't - if you visit any mall or high street most of the clothes shops are selling handbags with cherries on to look like the latests Louis Vuitton, or chiffon tops plainly emulating the Chloe ones from the catwalk. These items are not identical copies and they are not trying to be. And that's great - if you love the look but how many of us have 000 to spend on a top or a handbag? These items are not deciving you - they are in no way claiming to be Chloe or LV.
Fake items ARE and that's why they suck. No-one wants to be ripped off and too many people are ripped off from tops claiming to be Prada and sunglasses claiming to be Gucci.
If you can't afford real Seven or True Religion jeans or the Mulberry handbag you really really want, go to Topshop or Oasis or Miss Selfridge and you can have almost the same look for a fraction of the price. Please don't support counterfiet goods. If no-one buys them, counterfieters won't make money making them.
And if you are buying designer goods, PLEASE research what you are buying - know the brand, know the quality, do a little investigation on the seller. Always be aware that fake items are out there and don't waste your hard-earned money on them.
I hope that helps anyone shopping for Seven for all Mankind jeans - please email me though if there's anything you think i should add to this page, or if you have any questions.
There's a lot of confusion surrounding the various brands and the authenticity of some of the jeans avaiable on eBay so hopefully that clears it up a bit!!!
Want to shop more? Here's a list of excellent sellers all with the highest eBay reputations - just click here!
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